Live Discussion with Dr Simon Kyle - 13th February

Dr Kyle will be hosting a live online discussion here on Wednesday 13th February 7pm-8pm.

He will discuss as many topics as possible in the hour, starting with the most popular questions with answers being given in a way to give the most benefit to the general Community.

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Posted 7 Feb 2013 at 10:11 AM
  • 57 comments
  • 19 helped

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  • Sleepio Member

    • 21 comments
    • 11 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Hi Laura, my concern about the QHR is that it conditions you to being awake at night, so that your body just accepts it. Is this the case in your experience?

  • Sleepio Member

    • 1192 comments
    • 306 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    HI KaiteA – thanks for your post. I see you have just completed session 4 – so you will now be introduced to some cognitive techniques (also in session 5). I would say the best thing to do is to try and experiment with these to see which ones are most helpful. Relaxation can be very effective but it can take some time to master, and should be practised out-with the sleep period (say during the early evening) and over-time you can become skilled in relaxation.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 512 comments
    • 191 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Thanks Dr Kyle, very helpful. Got to disappear now and do some work (before my wind-down routine starts). Night, everyone!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 680 comments
    • 138 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Hi Natalie,
    When I first started SR I had to use the QHR quite a lot as it took a while for my sleep pressure to build. Once I had got to the point where I was sleeping through I only used the QHR on occasion. I still get periods of bad nights, where I wake often during the night, although I rarely need to get up any more as I have learnt to turn over & go back to sleep. I do find the broken sleep annoying though!! I think it's actually worse to have 4-5 very short wakenings than 1 longer one where you get up!!
    I'd be interested to hear what other's experiences have been in this area?

  • Sleepio Member

    • 143 comments
    • 25 helped
    Graduate

    Goodbye all, sleep well and have a good week.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 21 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Thanks for sharing your experience there. So I take it that it has had no adverse effects on that delicate homeostatic/circadian cycle. I am about to start SR this week, and am almost tempted to leave well alone, in case it gets worse!!

  • Sleepio Member

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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Hi EyesWideOpen – thanks for your post. That sounds like a lot of sleep deprivation over 3-4 days. One thing is that we are not always good at perceiving when we are asleep and awake, check out this article:
    Can you think you're awake when you're asleep?

    So it may be that you are getting some hours on those nights where you don't think you are getting anything. While the majority of people are helped through CBT a proportion of people do not benefit (maybe 20-25%), so it is possible that another approach is suitable for you. However, it is a good idea to go back to basics: revisit the techniques, make sure you are putting them into practice; consider trying cognitive techniques that you haven't tried for some time. In many ways, it's trying to be a scientist about it, working your way through the available strategies. have you noticed any changes in your sleep since starting the course?

  • Sleepio Member

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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    thanks Natalie – great question, that research just hasn't been done. However, what I can say is that the extent to which people re-structure their sleep, through techniques like SRT, modifies objective markers of sleep depth and has been related to subjective improvements in sleep over a CBT-based course. The research is ongoing though and I'm engaged in this just now. But from this early data it does seem possible to kick-start sleep pressure, which will most likely involve stabilising our body clock also.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 2 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Thanks Doctor. I have noticed that if I get a good (?) night's sleep it will be only 5 hrs and not the cherished 8 but I can cope with that. I am committed to the cause and will revisit basic techniques as you suggested. It was my desire to come off Zopi' altogether but I now feel I have to accept it twice a week.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 703 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Thanks for reply laurel I am five months into sleepio and have normal sleep back. It is just once every month or 6 weeks I will awake around 3am, but drop off to sleep within the hour and still have 8hrs although with a break in middle and still feel refreshed the following day as if I had 8hrs of unbroken sleep. So I feel lying their until I go back to sleep on odd occasion is ok.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 21 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Yay!!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 680 comments
    • 138 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Be aware that many people feel a lot worse before they begin to feel better!! Just be kind to yourself & if you need to take a nap or sleep a few minutes longer on occasion then do it! It does not mean you are a failure but just that you are human & getting used to a new regime.
    It does not work overnight! But the benefits if you stick with it can be amazing!
    Good luck with SR and let us know how you are doing next week!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 680 comments
    • 138 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Hi Bryan, it sounds as though you have the right idea! I think once your sleep has stabilised you develop a certain amount of resilience to any changes in your routine that enable you to spring back fairly easily!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 703 comments
    • 235 helped
    Graduate

    Goodnight everyone Off for five mile run. Have half marathon in 4 weeks time..

  • Sleepio Member

    • 21 comments
    • 11 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Will do, Im off to kick start my sluggish sleep system. Thanks for all those replies, and I look forward to a sneak previw of that research Dr Klye. Bye for now.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 1192 comments
    • 306 helped
    Expert

    Hi Folks, many thanks for joining tonight. Great session. Have a great week and speak next time.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 680 comments
    • 138 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Hi EWO,
    Please don't feel bad about needing to take some zopi! You are still on the road to recovery & you will continue to make progress long after you graduate. When you feel you are ready, speak to your GP who will be able to advise you on how to reduce your dose gradually.
    Also, it's possible that you don't need 8hrs sleep!! I certainly found that my sleep pattern has settled into between 5.5-7.5 hrs, depending on how stressful my week has been going!! I really thought I would end up sleeping the fabled 8hrs, but I just don't need it! I feel awful if I sleep longer than 7.5 nowadays, (unless I'm ill)

  • Sleepio Member

    • 680 comments
    • 138 helped
    Graduate

    Good night everyone, sleep well!

    Thank you Dr Kyle!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 1192 comments
    • 306 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    great post Laureloakwood, these are very wise comments. thanks

  • Sleepio Member

    • 208 comments
    • 62 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Hi Laureloakwood I am still waking around three times a night despite improvements in terms not usually being awake for hours in the night any more. I suspect I am stuck with the brief awakenings. I gather that as you get older (I'm 66) more frequent wakening is within normal limits, so reconceptualising it as normal is probably the answer!

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