Live discussion with Dr Jason Ong - 8th April

Hi all,

We're trying out a new timing for the live expert sessions adapted for our members based in the Americas. To kick things off, Dr Ong will be hosting the first of these live online discussions here on Wednesday 8th April, 8pm EDT.

If this timing doesn't suit you, please don't hesitate to still add your questions below and check back for Dr Ong's responses at a more convenient time.

To keep up with new comments as they are posted you will need to 'refresh' this discussion page.

To do this:

- On PC hit 'Ctrl' and 'R' or the 'F5' key
- On Mac hit 'Command' or 'Apple' and 'R'

Posted 4 Apr 2015 at 9:58 AM
  • 36 comments
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  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Sorry, but I don't know all of what comes with the different packages with Sleepio, so I can't answer your question.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Hi Liz,

    I see your dilemma. They key is to maintain a consistent wake up time, as that is very important for resetting your biological rhythm for sleep. If you can wake up consistently at 4:30am without going back to sleep, try doing that for 1-2 weeks and you will likely begin to find that your rhythms will begin to change.

    Alternatively, you might keep a later wake up time (say 6:30am) and just try to deal with the one day per week that you get up at 4:30am. It's not ideal, but I would suggest following the schedule that you think you can keep most consistent.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    I wish I could predict how things will go to give you some expectations, but everybody's situation is a little bit different.

    Having said that, I do think that the tools in Sleepio can be helpful to you, even though they seem generic. It has been a while since I have seen the order of what gets presented in each session, but I believe there are some tools in upcoming sessions for you that are related to relaxation and reducing sleep-related worries that might be more directly related to what you are looking for.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 11 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Thank you, that is helpful. So you think it is possible to change my natural tendency to be a night hawk?

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
    • 2 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Dany,

    If I had a nickel for every time a patient told me about “catching the second wind”, I would be a rich man!

    Seriously, this is very common comment from people with insomnia. It is not really doing anything to your sleep homeostasis. Instead, it seems that people with insomnia have a lot harder time falling asleep when they are trying (i.e., at bedtime) than when they are not trying (i.e, doing another activity about an hour before bedtime). The effort to sleep probably triggers the fight or flight system, which then creates the feeling of a “second wind.”

    It sounds to me that you might be paying too much attention to the sleep window, especially with the beginning of the window. See what happens if you try going to bed whenever you feel that sensation of sleepiness you described AFTER your sleep window has started. This might mean staying up and doing something else until you re-gain that sensation of sleepiness.

    It's there, you just have to let it come out!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 16 comments
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    Session 4

    Ugg – I dont have sleep related worries. I said that. I just dont sleep. Sleepio is very frustrating! Thanks….

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Liz,

    I can't say that it is possible to change your tendency for being a night hawk, but it is possible to change the biological rhythms that guide your sleep. For example, if you travel across several time zones, your body will eventually adjust to the new time zone and allow you to sleep at the new time zone. However, your preference for doing things later than others is more of a trait.

    This means that you will probably have to put more effort into maintaining a consistent wake up time than someone who is a morning lark. But as an evening type myself (which is why we are doing this during the evening time in the US!), I can tell you it's possible!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 11 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Thanks very much, I think this Sleepio program is excellent! I have tried bits of the suggestions in the past and thought they didn't work but concentrating on doing it as a program and having the community to encourage me through the rough patches has finally broken the bad sleep pattern that I have had for 25 years.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Sleep related worries can happen during the daytime, as focusing on feeling can actually make use feel more fatigued.

    I had a patient once who felt that 6.5 hours of sleep at night was his magic number for feeling good the next day. One time, during daylight savings, he thought he had slept for 7 hours and was feeling good so he went to the gym to attend a morning exercise class. Once he got there and nobody was at class, he realized that he forgot to reset his watch, which meant that he only had 6 hours of sleep rather than 7 hours. After that, he said he felt miserable the rest of the day.

    In this case, it wasn't how much sleep he actually received that mattered, but the attention given to needing a certain amount of sleep that led to how the patient felt the next day. Despite pointing this out to him, he wasn't willing to believe me.

    Sometimes, it is hard to change our mind!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    That's great to hear Liz! I often tell people that each individual part might not work by itself, but the package weaves together the elements that make the sum stronger than the parts. Good luck to you!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    And hang in there R57! I know that can feel frustrating, but keep an open mind and don't give up!

    You might also check in with others in the community to see how they have handled coming off sleep medications and using Sleepio.

  • Sleepio Member

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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Dibby,

    I would encourage you to speak with your doctor, as it is best to get a physical exam. Although disturbed sleep can have physical consequences, it would be wise to make sure your doctor can evaluate your symptoms.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Hi JackieC,

    Your first question sounds to me like hypnic jerks, which tend to occur as one is falling asleep. These are generally benign.

    Regarding the 15 min rule, I think it is a good guideline to follow but the key principle is that you get out of bed when you are no longer feeling sleepy. There is nothing magical about 15 minutes (or 30 or 45 for that matter), but the longer you stay in bed, the more you open yourself up to feeling frustrated or anxious about falling back to sleep. See my response to Chisqui for more info.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
    • 2 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Lew, your guess is right! It's best to keep to your sleep window, even if you have to follow the QHR once or twice at night. It is quite difficult when it gets closer to your scheduled wake up time, but remember trying to get more sleep that night is going to set you up for more disturbed sleep the following nights.

    So, keep the big picture in mind – following the recommendations will give you the best chance to “win the war”, if you have to sacrifice a few “battles” on any particular night.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
    • 2 helped
    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    Dave99,

    Thanks for your question. If you are snoring loudly and your wife is complaining, it is possible that you might have another type of sleep disorder called Sleep Apnea. I would encourage you to speak with your doctor about this, or seek out a sleep specialist.

    Sleepio can help improve your sleep duration and continuity, but it is not designed to solve other types of sleep problems that involve physical conditions.

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    Expert

    Hi folks! We have about another 30 minutes. Anyone else have questions?

  • Sleepio Member

    • 184 comments
    • 89 helped
    Graduate

    Thanks Dr. Ong for your time and all the answers!
    Cat

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Expert

    You're welcome!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 29 comments
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    Expert

    OK folks. I am signing off for tonight.

    Thanks for posting great questions and I wish all of you the best!

  • Sleepio Member

    • 38 comments
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    in reply to Sleepio Member
    Graduate

    Thanks for clarifying Dr Ong

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